Well, it looks like Mitt Romney’s speech didn’t have much of an impact on Mike Huckabee, who continues to play the anti-Mormon card in an obvious appeal to Evangelicals:
WASHINGTON — Republican presidential hopeful Mike Huckabee, an ordained Southern Baptist minister, asks in an upcoming article, “Don’t Mormons believe that Jesus and the devil are brothers?”
The article, to be published in Sunday’s New York Times Magazine, says Huckabee asked the question after saying he believes Mormonism is a religion but doesn’t know much about it. His rival Mitt Romney, the former Massachusetts governor, is a member of the Mormon church, which is known officially as the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints.
(…)
A spokeswoman for the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints said Huckabee’s question is usually raised by those who wish to smear the Mormon faith rather than clarify doctrine.
“We believe, as other Christians believe and as Paul wrote, that God is the father of all,” said the spokeswoman, Kim Farah. “That means that all beings were created by God and are his spirit children. Christ, on the other hand, was the only begotten in the flesh and we worship him as the son of God and the savior of mankind. Satan is the exact opposite of who Christ is and what he stands for.”
That, you would think, would be the end of that. But something tells me Huckabee will continue with stealth nonsense like this as long as he thinks it helps.
December 12th, 2007 at 9:13 am
Would it have been better if he characterized the devil and Jesus as “half-brothers”?
December 12th, 2007 at 9:29 am
The biggest problem with his comment is the word “Don’t” and the question mark.
Anyone, including Huckabee and his staff could find out in a minute what is contained on the Church’s public websites mormon.org and lds.org concerning any topic.
The fact that Huckabee posed a question as if he didn’t know what Mormons believed, seems to indicate that he was being very dishonest in his statement.
If as a Baptist Minister and presidential candidate he indeed didn’t know anything about the beliefs of his main opponent, he seems to be someone who is seriously uninformed.
December 12th, 2007 at 10:08 am
Here is the Huckabee campaign’s response:
LITTLE ROCK, AR – A report released tonight cites an upcoming article in the Sunday edition of The New York Times Magazine which quotes former Arkansas Governor and Presidential Candidate Mike Huckabee asking a question about the content of the Mormon faith. In fact, the full context of the exchange makes it clear that Governor Huckabee was illustrating his unwillingness to answer questions about Mormonism and to avoid addressing theological questions during this campaign.
“Governor Huckabee has said consistently that he believes this campaign should center on a discussion of the important issues confronting our nation,” said Senior Advisor, Dr. Charmaine Yoest, “and not focus on questions of religious belief. He wants to assure persons of all faith traditions of his firm commitment to religious tolerance and freedom of worship. Governor Huckabee believes that one of the great strengths of our nation lies in its diversity of thought, opinion and faith.”
And about the LDS Response:
The LDS Church spokeswoman’s comments are terribly flawed. For one thing, Christians do not consider God to be the father of all. The Bible speaks of many whose father is the devil. Those who are children of God are said to be “adopted” as sons, not natural sons. And Jesus Christ is not a literal child of God as LDS theology teaches. He IS (the one and only) God, manifested in flesh to demonstrate his perfect character to us. Lucifer, in fact, cannot be a spirit brother of Jesus as he was created by Jesus (see Colossians 1:15-16)
Clearly, the LDS teaching is that Jesus and Lucifer are spirit brothers. This is what LDS.org says about this subject:
How can Jesus and Lucifer be spirit brothers when their characters and purposes are so utterly opposed?
Jess L. Christensen, “I Have a Question,” Ensign, June 1986, 25–26
Jess L. Christensen, Institute of Religion director at Utah State University, Logan, Utah. On first hearing, the doctrine that Lucifer and our Lord, Jesus Christ, are brothers may seem surprising to some—especially to those unacquainted with latter-day revelations. But both the scriptures and the prophets affirm that Jesus Christ and Lucifer are indeed offspring of our Heavenly Father and, therefore, spirit brothers. Jesus Christ was with the Father from the beginning. Lucifer, too, was an angel “who was in authority in the presence of God,” a “son of the morning.” (See Isa. 14:12; D&C 76:25–27.) Both Jesus and Lucifer were strong leaders with great knowledge and influence. But as the Firstborn of the Father, Jesus was Lucifer’s older brother. (See Col. 1:15; D&C 93:21.)
How could two such great spirits become so totally opposite? The answer lies in the principle of agency, which has existed from all eternity. (See D&C 93:30–31.) Of Lucifer, the scripture says that because of rebellion “he became Satan, yea, even the devil, the father of all lies.” (Moses 4:4.) Note that he was not created evil, but became Satan by his own choice.
When our Father in Heaven presented his plan of salvation, Jesus sustained the plan and his part in it, giving the glory to God, to whom it properly belonged. Lucifer, on the other hand, sought power, honor, and glory only for himself. (See Isa. 14:13–14; Moses 4:1–2.) When his modification of the Father’s plan was rejected, he rebelled against God and was subsequently cast out of heaven with those who had sided with him. (See Rev. 12:7–9; D&C 29:36–37.)
For a well documented comparison between LDS and non-LDS Christian teachings see: http://www.whatmormonsdonttell.com
December 12th, 2007 at 10:27 am
Frankly, I don’t really care what Mormons believe. But Dukakabee got this wrong.
December 12th, 2007 at 12:05 pm
The Mormon church is better than the Huckster at offerring slick statements that blur important distinctions. Please don’t take anything from their PR folks at face value.
December 12th, 2007 at 12:07 pm
Leslie,
The more important question we need to ask ourselves is why the media is falling for Huckabee’s game and debating the finer points of Mormon theology
December 12th, 2007 at 12:14 pm
With this making news and all the reaction and interest, it’s obvious to me that doctrine does matter. The fact is, despite what others may want to think, that many do care if their leaders are being led by the same God/Jesus as they are. What LDS don’t understand is that Christians hold to Jesus being the unique Son of God. That means for them, they think that He’s God the Son. He’s the second person of the *only* God there is. Every other son of God is not a son with the nature of God. They are creatures with different natures (e.g., angels and humans). Jesus, for Christians, is exalted above anything imaginable, since He is literally the Creator of everything outside Himself–including us and Lucifer (Jn. 1:1-3, 14; Rom. 9:5; and Col. 1:13-18). LDS devalue Jesus since He didn’t create everything. LDS don’t even believe that there is a God for any world who is God by nature. Each God (since Mormons are polytheists) had to become a god, and is worshipped exclusively for that world. “Worthy” LDS hope to become gods of their own worlds to receive exclusive worship from their own spirit kids. But Jesus taught there is only one true God (Jn. 17:3), and He warned us of false prophets and false Christs that would come in the last days (Mt. 24:24).
December 12th, 2007 at 12:15 pm
Of course Huckabee doesn’t know what the Mormons believe, the Mormons don’t even know what the hell they believe. You can goto the “official website of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints” and read some of the stuff there and then ask a Mormon about it they’ll tell you it’s wrong.
Of course I can’t speak for the actually Mormon’s themselves, but Joseph Smith their “prophet” repeatedly wrote that God is nothing more than a human being just like us who became a God through living a good life and that we can also do the same. He also wrote that the most important revelation ever revaled to men in the quest to becoming a god is plural marriage, and without plural marriage becoming a god is impossible. Joseph wrote that plural marriage is an “everlasting covenant”, yet here we are 200 years later and that all so important everlasting covenant is rejecting by many Morman Churches because they were all constant under observation by government authorities and many were arrested, as was Jeff Warren recently. The idea that God is nothing more than us human is blasphemy, and to top it off they actually sing prasies to Joseph Smith in their church sessions, something which is obviously forbidden in the Bible. I could go on and on about the huge errors and contradictions in the Mormon theology, but it would be easier for you to goto MormonChallenge.org (or maybe its .com, or both, can’t remember) and watch the videos they have. They’re put together by former Mormons.
Bottom line is that Mormonism is just a cult that tries to associate itself with the Bible in attempt to gain credibility, though it ignores any part of the Bible that it doesn’t like. Mormons will try to side-step this issue by yelling “bigot” or “don’t judge me” or some other logical fallacy, but the facts are all there. Mormonism is wrong and the Bible specifially says, in one of Paul’s letters, that God will judge those outside the church (unbelievers), but that it is our responsibility to judge those inside the church (believers, or those that claim to be in this case).
December 12th, 2007 at 2:07 pm
Wow- Huckabee continues to show his intolerence for others. The Dems will have a victory for sure if he gets the nom. Someone who suggested isolating HIV/Aids patients, releases sickos from prison only to rape and murder again, and bashes other religions publicly does NOT deserve my vote….I will vote Dem for sure if he is the Republican nom. It is sad to see that there is still so much BIGOTRY in this nation. Shame on you. Even reading some of these posts shows that there are plenty of so-called “Christians” out there who really are haters at heart. I’m also amazed at people who spend so much time and energy bashing Mormons- who cares? What a shame that they don’t do something better. Some of this Mormon bashing in the above posts reminds me of…Hitler’s Germany? Genocide in Darfur? Problems in Iraq/Afganistan? All started with religious bashing and hating? I can only imagine the uproar if these comments were being made against my Jewish friends. Wow….Where am I and what century is it? Can’t you all focus on the more important issues that will affect this election?
December 12th, 2007 at 2:13 pm
Its amazing how much time and effort is put into trying to discredit the Mormon church. I wonder if all the “Christian” groups attempt to do the same for other faiths? Or is it just Mormons they are afraid of. As far as Huckabee goes, he knew exactly what he was doing with when he made his comment in the article. Just like every other anti-Mormon rhetoric trying to make things sound positive and gradually getting negative to make people afraid of Mormonism.
December 12th, 2007 at 2:18 pm
…Son of the morning?…(Biblical reference to Lucifer)…Whose Son?? Now, okay all you bible scholars…Next, explain the Nicene Creed..and then protest against it..then create your own version of Heavenly Administration…and translate the bible to your own words, leaving out books and phrases…
Then, vote for a political candidate and his administration’s agenda about running and fixing the woes of this country, i.e. the “Real Issues”..and maybe the gender or color of his/her skin, or ethnic background won’t matter either.
Or does …maybe…the meaning of political integrity of any candidate truly escape the media circus…because religion is such a passion? or because most people do not vote or understand the real issues…30% voter turnout???
STOP WORRYING ABOUT RELIGION, $500 HAIRCUTS AND WHAT OPRAH THINKs!!! Study the issues and vote!!!
December 12th, 2007 at 3:29 pm
The big problem is that this is what involving religion in our government brings. Thomas Jefferson is spinning in his grave every time religion plays such an overt role in our government.
December 12th, 2007 at 4:02 pm
My point in making these statements is that I truly am a bigot and a mormon-hater deep down inside. I love the fact that a Mormon is running for president so that I finally have the opportunity to lash out against this christian religion that scare mes and other evangelicals so much (even if it does not have anything to do with whether or not Romney would make a good president for the U.S.). Sure, if I was truly engaged in spreading Christianity I would focus on those who do not believe in Jesus as the Savior of the world, but I prefer to espouse lies and half-truths about this religion because that is who I am.
December 12th, 2007 at 4:46 pm
D McV: are you being sarcastic in your comment about being afraid of the Mormons? I couldn’t tell, but I certainly don’t understand your message either way. If you’re being serious, I’m a Mormon, and I can’t offer you a single good reason to be afraid of me or any of the thousands of Mormons with whom I’ve been associated in my lifetime. And although I haven’t decided yet who to vote for (amazing isn’t it? I’m actually paying attention to the political issues rather than religion of each candidate?), I can’t see any reason to be afraid of Mitt Romney’s religion, either. The sad thing is that I was actually really considering Mr. Huckabee, but his recent behavior has given me pause…I can’t tell where his real feelings lie anymore or what he really wants for this country.
December 14th, 2007 at 7:52 pm
I’m really getting tired of hearing from Hewitt and others how if one votes against Romney simply because he’s LDS, then that person is a “bigot.” Similarly, I’m also tired of hearing, “We are not electing a pastor-in-chief, but a commander-in-chief.”
First, suppose there is another candidate H who holds roughly identical moral and political values with R. Both are roughly identical in terms of experience and integrity, but H differs from R in that the former holds to the majority’s theological values. Under such a scenario, it does not seem that one is a bigot if he or she votes for H on the basis of shared theological values.
Second, suppose there’s a dear sweet grandma who doesn’t follow politics much. She could never hold her own politically with the likes of Hewitt. Yet she loves the Lord, and wants someone in office who will not only be an individual of integrity (not necessarily a pastor, although that would be nice), but someone who will trust her Lord to lead this nation. She holds this on the basis of good reasons, not on the basis of mere preference. This is a value she does not share with Mormons, since she knows that Mormons follow an idolatrous, blasphemous, and imaginary god. For her, this value is fundamental for all other values. Thus, she refuses to vote for Romney. There is no hatred on her part toward Romney or others who are not of her faith. She would rather have someone in office, who is not simply a “person of faith,” but a “person of the Christian faith.”
Does that entail that she’s a bigot? For someone to claim that it does, then it seems just as fair to call that individual a bigot against God-fearing folk who want their leaders to follow and trust the same God they do. Hewitt, et.al need to be more careful when throwing the “bigot” card out. If it merely means an “intolerant individual,” then obviously what is sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander as it were, and Hewitt, et.al are bigots themselves.
But who wants to be known as a “bigot” anyway? The real problem here is that this term is smuggling in modern notions of “intolerance.” As such, the terms mean wrongly being against something when everything should be accepted (except of course those who are against something the other group does not like). This is strictly applied to religious beliefs, which are automatically ruled out from political discussion. What matters here is if all the other values are the same. Thus, in the political realm, all religious views are equally acceptable. Of course on the other hand, traditional notions of “intolerance” are acceptable when these other non-religious values are not the same. Here the term means rightly being against something and not everything can or should be accepted. So as a result of this language, Hewitt, et.al have created a radical ad hoc separation between religion and politics.
The “separation of church and state” is something entirely different. It simply means that the state cannot play favorites politically and establish a state-run Church. The state must also not inhibit the free exercise of religion by individuals in or out of the government.
What Hewitt, et.al are claiming is that one’s religious beliefs should have no bearing as a criterion for deciding who should be voted into office. So long as the candidate shares our other (conservative) values, then what God is worshipped is irrelevant. But on my view, it is insufficient to scare people into this Hewitt position by playing the “bigot” card. Some things rightly deserve intolerance, and being intolerant of voting someone in office with a false god seems at least prima facie like one of those things.
December 19th, 2007 at 12:44 pm
Baptists like Huckabee are afraid of Mormons because they do missionary work and “steal their flock”, which means they make less money for preaching. They are deathly afraid of Romney because they threaten to be exposed. All of this anti-Mormon bashing which has been done for decades will be exposed for what it is… cheap religious bigotry. Gov. Romney is a Christian by his actions, and the public will take notice. This scares evangelicals… to be caught in this grand lie they’ve been propagating.
December 19th, 2007 at 12:47 pm
Two questions:
1. Suppose that Christ and Lucifer are brothers. Why is that so offensive? Christ and Hitler are both spirit children of God, at least according to the Bible.
2. What is the relevance of such a doctrine to one being able to lead this country? Obviously Huckabee thought it was a relevant question… otherwise he wouldn’t have asked it.
December 25th, 2007 at 11:38 pm
Huckabee, as a former preacher in the south, knows a lot about the LDS Church. Down south here, the Southern Baptists and other denominations have spent a lot of time and money trying to marginalize the Mormons and perpetuate the idea that Mormons aren’t Christian, etc. The old “Jesus and Satan are brothers” comment is a regular feature of the anti-Mormon literature and preaching that goes on around here. (I’ve lived in the south since 1971 myself so I’m quite familiar) Even in the past year or so the local Baptist church in my small town brought in a visiting preacher to preach specifically against the Mormons. Why?
Huckabee was once head of the Arkansas Baptist Convention. I’ll bet he has had a discussion or two about the Mormons. He even spoke at the Southern Baptist Convention’s national meeting that was held in Salt Lake City in the late 90’s. One of the main thrusts of the conference was how to deal with Mormons and there was anti-Mormon literature passed around. Yet Huckabee says, “I don’t know much about the Mormon faith, don’t they believe Jesus and Satan were brothers?” Is he really asking the interviewer to clarify Mormon doctrine for him, or is Huckabee simply revealing himself to be a joke of a candidate whose only purpose is to keep the “evangelicals” from straying outside the coop.
He and his collegues have spent too much time and money trying to marginalize the Mormons to let the evangelicals take a look at Romney and say, “You know, this guy looks pretty good. He’s an excellent executive, a stellar family man of high moral fiber. He’s got a great track record while Governor, etc.”
Now, not everyone who opposes Romney is a bigot, but remember the guy in New Hampshire who refused to shake Romney’s hand because he wouldn’t shake hands with a Mormon? There are many out there, as well as many who have simply been kept ignorant and suspicious by their local pastors.
December 31st, 2007 at 9:31 pm
Mr. McVicer,
You don’t have a clue what you are talking about. In fact, you need to shut your yap and read a little bit and study. Have you ever even prayed in your life. I find that most religions try to change their values to gain members. I think you are trying to make your own religion. Don’t spout off to the world things you know nothing about. Fact is, God the father sent his son Jesus Christ into the world to give the world a new law, Love one another. Doesn’t sound like you even like the mormons. So explain to me how you can look at the God you believe in and tell him that you didn’t bear false witness when you were here and also love your neighbor. You openly break these commandments. I don’t know why anyone who is a Christian would listen to your trash and agree with it as they would be openly breaking commandments.
January 10th, 2008 at 6:32 pm
So frankly to you Texan… your wrong the Mormon religion is also Christian… We BELIEVE IN CHRIST can we make it any more obvious… It’s in our official name The Church Of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints…. oh and by the way tell Huckabee that he has lost all the votes of the Mormons even if he makes it to Generals… I know that I rather Have a Democratic President then a religion bashing one….
February 4th, 2008 at 10:37 pm
I know how people feel about anti-Mormon bigotry. I’ve dealt with Christophobia and it’s not fun. For the record, Huckabee was not being critical of the LDS faith — he was pointing out how foolish it can be to talk about someone else’s religion when you don’t have the facts. The author of the article admitted this and he also acknowledged that Huckabee stated Mormonism is a religion and not a cult. FWIW: The LDS doctrine is hard to explain, but Jess L.
Christensen, Institute of Religion director at Utah State University, Logan, Utah, a noted Mormon Apologist explains it in an Ensign Magazine article here: http://www.givesmore.info/lds-brothers/
Both Huckabee and Romney dropped this discussion months ago. I think it’s in all our interest to move on. There is no place for religious bigotry in this campaign. After all, we’re electing a president and not a “Prime Minister”. Bessings on you.